Discussion:
Windows Is A Great OS ... If Your Time Is Worth Nothing
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Lawrence D'Oliveiro
2025-02-21 21:48:06 UTC
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“Dozens of things you can do to clean up a fresh install of Windows 11
24H2 and Edge”
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/02/what-i-do-to-clean-up-a-clean-install-of-windows-11-23h2-and-edge/>.

Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
Alan K.
2025-02-21 22:34:31 UTC
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Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
“Dozens of things you can do to clean up a fresh install of Windows 11
24H2 and Edge”
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/02/what-i-do-to-clean-up-a-clean-install-of-windows-11-23h2-and-edge/>.
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
Ah, but if you do a lot of this, your time is worth a lot.
A cleaner decluttered system could make it just that more appealing. Hey, anything can help.
--
Linux Mint 22.1, Cinnamon 6.4.7, Kernel 6.8.0-53-generic
Thunderbird 128.7.0esr, Mozilla Firefox 135.0
Alan K.
Lawrence D'Oliveiro
2025-02-21 23:44:49 UTC
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Post by Alan K.
Ah, but if you do a lot of this, your time is worth a lot.
So, the more your time is worth, the greater the expense of maintaining
your Microsoft Windows setup?
DFS
2025-02-22 00:36:54 UTC
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Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
It's amusing that a variety of lying Linux idiots thru the years have
claimed it takes week(s) to install/configure Windows.

Or that they work "thousands of unpaid hours" because of Windows crashes.

Or that one Linux box does the work of 6 Windows boxes.

Or that Linux is 50x faster than Windows.

Never change, bozos!
-hh
2025-02-22 02:30:24 UTC
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Post by DFS
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
It's amusing that a variety of lying Linux idiots thru the years have
claimed it takes week(s) to install/configure Windows.
...as we get the updates from one such Master, where it only takes a few
months of work until their system is finally able to boot up.


-hh
chrisv
2025-02-22 11:36:01 UTC
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Permalink
Post by DFS
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
It's amusing that a variety of lying Linux idiots thru the years have
claimed it takes week(s) to install/configure Windows.
No more amusing than some dumb fscking liar claiming that "getting
Linux up and running involves lots of luck, and patience".
--
"Getting Linux up and running involves lots of luck, and patience, and
the right hardware, and distro, and version." - some dumb fsck
Joel
2025-02-22 11:41:57 UTC
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Post by chrisv
Post by DFS
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
It's amusing that a variety of lying Linux idiots thru the years have
claimed it takes week(s) to install/configure Windows.
No more amusing than some dumb fscking liar claiming that "getting
Linux up and running involves lots of luck, and patience".
I don't believe in luck. You can run Win10/11, macOS or GNU/Linux,
and do marvelous things. You can also do what Larry does, and be like
a rat of a human.
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
RonB
2025-02-22 23:10:13 UTC
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Permalink
Post by chrisv
Post by DFS
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
It's amusing that a variety of lying Linux idiots thru the years have
claimed it takes week(s) to install/configure Windows.
No more amusing than some dumb fscking liar claiming that "getting
Linux up and running involves lots of luck, and patience".
And a lot closer to the truth — although I know of NO ONE who ever said it
takes *weeks* to install and configure Windows — it used to take several
hours, however. So yet another lying, strawman argument by (I'm guessing)
DuFuS — since he fits the description of "dumb fsck."
--
“Evil is not able to create anything new, it can only distort and destroy
what has been invented or made by the forces of good.” —J.R.R. Tolkien
Joel
2025-02-23 00:16:15 UTC
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Permalink
Post by RonB
Post by chrisv
Post by DFS
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
It's amusing that a variety of lying Linux idiots thru the years have
claimed it takes week(s) to install/configure Windows.
No more amusing than some dumb fscking liar claiming that "getting
Linux up and running involves lots of luck, and patience".
And a lot closer to the truth — although I know of NO ONE who ever said it
takes *weeks* to install and configure Windows — it used to take several
hours, however. So yet another lying, strawman argument by (I'm guessing)
DuFuS — since he fits the description of "dumb fsck."
Using Linux avoids the complexities of controlling Windows. Even
without doing Larry's lunacy.
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
Joel
2025-02-22 03:02:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by DFS
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
It's amusing that a variety of lying Linux idiots thru the years have
claimed it takes week(s) to install/configure Windows.
Or that they work "thousands of unpaid hours" because of Windows crashes.
Or that one Linux box does the work of 6 Windows boxes.
Or that Linux is 50x faster than Windows.
Never change, bozos!
Way to miss Lawrence's point, goofball, I wouldn't claim that Linux is
magical, but it does do a better job of caring about what it releases,
apparently, I mean maybe it depends a good bit on the choice of
distro, but M$ is releasing betas again. Again. How can you defend
this? You could still be on 23H2, of course, yourself - but if I were
using Win11, I'd have installed 24H2 on its release, as was my habit,
you recall, and it *probably* would've been great on *my* system,
since I bought real parts, but there are random OEM users who are
seekers, and install these updates hurriedly, and M$ is like "oh yeah
fuck you, dumbass, we don't give a shit about testing for your crap
computer".
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
chrisv
2025-02-22 11:46:22 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Joel
(snip lies)
Way to miss Lawrence's point, goofball,
Any hyperbole or unfairness from Linux advocates pales in comparison
to the avalanche of idiocy and lies from the haters. Documented ad
nauseum, in here.
--
'He thinks "open" means bug free.' - Hadron Quark, lying shamelessly
Joel
2025-02-22 16:33:55 UTC
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Permalink
Post by chrisv
Post by Joel
(snip lies)
Way to miss Lawrence's point, goofball,
Any hyperbole or unfairness from Linux advocates pales in comparison
to the avalanche of idiocy and lies from the haters. Documented ad
nauseum, in here.
The only reason I promoted Win7 here, in the past, was because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
Adison Vohn Caterson
2025-02-22 17:23:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joel
Post by chrisv
Post by Joel
(snip lies)
Way to miss Lawrence's point, goofball,
Any hyperbole or unfairness from Linux advocates pales in comparison
to the avalanche of idiocy and lies from the haters. Documented ad
nauseum, in here.
The only reason I promoted Win7 here, in the past, was because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?

I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.

On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.

Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.

The choices being available is the winner.
--
End Transmission
Joel
2025-02-22 20:58:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I [Joel W. Crump] promoted Win7 here [COLA], in the past [2009-2010], [...] because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
If it makes no difference which platform one is using, then Linux is
the winner by default. That became true before the release of
Windows 11.
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Win11 is OK on hardware that handles it. Win10 is still OK on a good
bit of other hardware and on the same hardware for people who don't
want 11. I guess the $30 charge would be fair except I did
voluntarily pay again in 2021, $200, so my upgrade to 11 was
immediate. Why can't I freely choose between 11 and 10, on this
device, during the extended-security-update-availability period?
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
Adison Vohn Caterson
2025-02-22 21:22:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I [Joel W. Crump] promoted Win7 here [COLA], in the past [2009-2010], [...] because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
If it makes no difference which platform one is using, then Linux is
the winner by default. That became true before the release of
Windows 11.
That kinda makes no sense.
If the OS makes no diffence to the user, that it's a tie, or a
non-issue. A no-win situation.
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Win11 is OK on hardware that handles it. Win10 is still OK on a good
bit of other hardware and on the same hardware for people who don't
want 11. I guess the $30 charge would be fair except I did
voluntarily pay again in 2021, $200, so my upgrade to 11 was
immediate. Why can't I freely choose between 11 and 10, on this
device, during the extended-security-update-availability period?
Microsoft I would think have no financial gain to support the OS past
the 7 years or whatever time period they choose. I wouldn't do free work
7 years after I did the initial work, I'd want money :)

Whether these changes, updates, upgrades are of value to the user is up
to the user. If one prefers free, pay once forever, want the computer to
last 15 years, Linux would likely be the only choice.

But if one just has to have MS Office, or some tax software, or some
device integration that only Windows provides, that's what they'll use.
The usual preference is that the computer came with the OS, meaning no
preference.
--
End Transmission
Lawrence D'Oliveiro
2025-02-22 21:30:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Microsoft I would think have no financial gain to support the OS past
the 7 years or whatever time period they choose.
I don’t think Microsoft is getting much financial gain of any sort from
any version of Windows any more. That would explain the deteriorating
quality of Windows updates: it’s down to decreasing investment on
Microsoft’s part, as a direct response to those decreasing profits.
Joel
2025-02-22 21:46:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I [Joel W. Crump] promoted Win7 here [COLA], in the past [2009-2010], [...] because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
If it makes no difference which platform one is using, then Linux is
the winner by default. That became true before the release of
Windows 11.
That kinda makes no sense.
If the OS makes no diffence to the user, that it's a tie, or a
non-issue. A no-win situation.
A tie makes the elegant and free Linux the obvious winner.
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Win11 is OK on hardware that handles it. Win10 is still OK on a good
bit of other hardware and on the same hardware for people who don't
want 11. I guess the $30 charge would be fair except I did
voluntarily pay again in 2021, $200, so my upgrade to 11 was
immediate. Why can't I freely choose between 11 and 10, on this
device, during the extended-security-update-availability period?
Microsoft I would think have no financial gain to support the OS past
the 7 years or whatever time period they choose. I wouldn't do free work
7 years after I did the initial work, I'd want money :)
Whether these changes, updates, upgrades are of value to the user is up
to the user. If one prefers free, pay once forever, want the computer to
last 15 years, Linux would likely be the only choice.
But if one just has to have MS Office, or some tax software, or some
device integration that only Windows provides, that's what they'll use.
The usual preference is that the computer came with the OS, meaning no
preference.
I don't like Apple macOS - but it is as good as Windows and Linux.

If you see where I'm going with this.
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
Adison Vohn Caterson
2025-02-23 13:31:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I [Joel W. Crump] promoted Win7 here [COLA], in the past [2009-2010], [...] because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
If it makes no difference which platform one is using, then Linux is
the winner by default. That became true before the release of
Windows 11.
That kinda makes no sense.
If the OS makes no diffence to the user, that it's a tie, or a
non-issue. A no-win situation.
A tie makes the elegant and free Linux the obvious winner.
A tie is a no-win situation.
For you and your situation, Linux is better.
Not sure what elegance you see... visually, Windows "looks" better.
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Win11 is OK on hardware that handles it. Win10 is still OK on a good
bit of other hardware and on the same hardware for people who don't
want 11. I guess the $30 charge would be fair except I did
voluntarily pay again in 2021, $200, so my upgrade to 11 was
immediate. Why can't I freely choose between 11 and 10, on this
device, during the extended-security-update-availability period?
Microsoft I would think have no financial gain to support the OS past
the 7 years or whatever time period they choose. I wouldn't do free work
7 years after I did the initial work, I'd want money :)
Whether these changes, updates, upgrades are of value to the user is up
to the user. If one prefers free, pay once forever, want the computer to
last 15 years, Linux would likely be the only choice.
But if one just has to have MS Office, or some tax software, or some
device integration that only Windows provides, that's what they'll use.
The usual preference is that the computer came with the OS, meaning no
preference.
I don't like Apple macOS - but it is as good as Windows and Linux.
If you see where I'm going with this.
I do.
You have an opinion.
Yay.
--
End Transmission
Joel
2025-02-23 19:29:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I [Joel W. Crump] promoted Win7 here [COLA], in the past [2009-2010], [...] because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
If it makes no difference which platform one is using, then Linux is
the winner by default. That became true before the release of
Windows 11.
That kinda makes no sense.
If the OS makes no diffence to the user, that it's a tie, or a
non-issue. A no-win situation.
A tie makes the elegant and free Linux the obvious winner.
A tie is a no-win situation.
For you and your situation, Linux is better.
Not sure what elegance you see... visually, Windows "looks" better.
Wrong.
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Win11 is OK on hardware that handles it. Win10 is still OK on a good
bit of other hardware and on the same hardware for people who don't
want 11. I guess the $30 charge would be fair except I did
voluntarily pay again in 2021, $200, so my upgrade to 11 was
immediate. Why can't I freely choose between 11 and 10, on this
device, during the extended-security-update-availability period?
Microsoft I would think have no financial gain to support the OS past
the 7 years or whatever time period they choose. I wouldn't do free work
7 years after I did the initial work, I'd want money :)
Whether these changes, updates, upgrades are of value to the user is up
to the user. If one prefers free, pay once forever, want the computer to
last 15 years, Linux would likely be the only choice.
But if one just has to have MS Office, or some tax software, or some
device integration that only Windows provides, that's what they'll use.
The usual preference is that the computer came with the OS, meaning no
preference.
I don't like Apple macOS - but it is as good as Windows and Linux.
If you see where I'm going with this.
I do.
You have an opinion.
Yay.
No, an observation.
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
Adison Vohn Caterson
2025-02-23 20:44:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I [Joel W. Crump] promoted Win7 here [COLA], in the past [2009-2010], [...] because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
If it makes no difference which platform one is using, then Linux is
the winner by default. That became true before the release of
Windows 11.
That kinda makes no sense.
If the OS makes no diffence to the user, that it's a tie, or a
non-issue. A no-win situation.
A tie makes the elegant and free Linux the obvious winner.
A tie is a no-win situation.
For you and your situation, Linux is better.
Not sure what elegance you see... visually, Windows "looks" better.
Wrong.
Then explain how Linux is the winner?
What's it winning?

If Russia nuked New York, they'd only kill 5 Linux users.
Not counting Android, we're talking PC's.
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Win11 is OK on hardware that handles it. Win10 is still OK on a good
bit of other hardware and on the same hardware for people who don't
want 11. I guess the $30 charge would be fair except I did
voluntarily pay again in 2021, $200, so my upgrade to 11 was
immediate. Why can't I freely choose between 11 and 10, on this
device, during the extended-security-update-availability period?
Microsoft I would think have no financial gain to support the OS past
the 7 years or whatever time period they choose. I wouldn't do free work
7 years after I did the initial work, I'd want money :)
Whether these changes, updates, upgrades are of value to the user is up
to the user. If one prefers free, pay once forever, want the computer to
last 15 years, Linux would likely be the only choice.
But if one just has to have MS Office, or some tax software, or some
device integration that only Windows provides, that's what they'll use.
The usual preference is that the computer came with the OS, meaning no
preference.
I don't like Apple macOS - but it is as good as Windows and Linux.
If you see where I'm going with this.
I do.
You have an opinion.
Yay.
No, an observation.
Other than on your computer, what observations lead you to believe Linux
is winning?

Capturing me as a new user doesn't count.
I'm part time, yet to be seized by the rapture.
--
End Transmission
Joel
2025-02-23 20:47:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I [Joel W. Crump] promoted Win7 here [COLA], in the past [2009-2010], [...] because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
If it makes no difference which platform one is using, then Linux is
the winner by default. That became true before the release of
Windows 11.
That kinda makes no sense.
If the OS makes no diffence to the user, that it's a tie, or a
non-issue. A no-win situation.
A tie makes the elegant and free Linux the obvious winner.
A tie is a no-win situation.
For you and your situation, Linux is better.
Not sure what elegance you see... visually, Windows "looks" better.
Wrong.
Then explain how Linux is the winner?
What's it winning?
If Russia nuked New York, they'd only kill 5 Linux users.
Not counting Android, we're talking PC's.
Windows 11 has a pretty layout but so does Cinnamon.
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Win11 is OK on hardware that handles it. Win10 is still OK on a good
bit of other hardware and on the same hardware for people who don't
want 11. I guess the $30 charge would be fair except I did
voluntarily pay again in 2021, $200, so my upgrade to 11 was
immediate. Why can't I freely choose between 11 and 10, on this
device, during the extended-security-update-availability period?
Microsoft I would think have no financial gain to support the OS past
the 7 years or whatever time period they choose. I wouldn't do free work
7 years after I did the initial work, I'd want money :)
Whether these changes, updates, upgrades are of value to the user is up
to the user. If one prefers free, pay once forever, want the computer to
last 15 years, Linux would likely be the only choice.
But if one just has to have MS Office, or some tax software, or some
device integration that only Windows provides, that's what they'll use.
The usual preference is that the computer came with the OS, meaning no
preference.
I don't like Apple macOS - but it is as good as Windows and Linux.
If you see where I'm going with this.
I do.
You have an opinion.
Yay.
No, an observation.
Other than on your computer, what observations lead you to believe Linux
is winning?
Capturing me as a new user doesn't count.
I'm part time, yet to be seized by the rapture.
It's not even contestable, Linux wins because it isn't the behemoth.
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
Adison Vohn Caterson
2025-02-23 20:54:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I [Joel W. Crump] promoted Win7 here [COLA], in the past [2009-2010], [...] because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
If it makes no difference which platform one is using, then Linux is
the winner by default. That became true before the release of
Windows 11.
That kinda makes no sense.
If the OS makes no diffence to the user, that it's a tie, or a
non-issue. A no-win situation.
A tie makes the elegant and free Linux the obvious winner.
A tie is a no-win situation.
For you and your situation, Linux is better.
Not sure what elegance you see... visually, Windows "looks" better.
Wrong.
Then explain how Linux is the winner?
What's it winning?
If Russia nuked New York, they'd only kill 5 Linux users.
Not counting Android, we're talking PC's.
Windows 11 has a pretty layout but so does Cinnamon.
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Win11 is OK on hardware that handles it. Win10 is still OK on a good
bit of other hardware and on the same hardware for people who don't
want 11. I guess the $30 charge would be fair except I did
voluntarily pay again in 2021, $200, so my upgrade to 11 was
immediate. Why can't I freely choose between 11 and 10, on this
device, during the extended-security-update-availability period?
Microsoft I would think have no financial gain to support the OS past
the 7 years or whatever time period they choose. I wouldn't do free work
7 years after I did the initial work, I'd want money :)
Whether these changes, updates, upgrades are of value to the user is up
to the user. If one prefers free, pay once forever, want the computer to
last 15 years, Linux would likely be the only choice.
But if one just has to have MS Office, or some tax software, or some
device integration that only Windows provides, that's what they'll use.
The usual preference is that the computer came with the OS, meaning no
preference.
I don't like Apple macOS - but it is as good as Windows and Linux.
If you see where I'm going with this.
I do.
You have an opinion.
Yay.
No, an observation.
Other than on your computer, what observations lead you to believe Linux
is winning?
Capturing me as a new user doesn't count.
I'm part time, yet to be seized by the rapture.
It's not even contestable, Linux wins because it isn't the behemoth.
I knew it was just the company.
I don't like WalMart, but I will secretly shop there ;)
--
End Transmission
Joel
2025-02-23 22:05:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Linux wins because it isn't the behemoth.
I knew it was just the company.
I don't like WalMart, but I will secretly shop there ;)
Linux supports my WiFi, made in China, edge technology as WiFi6 is
evolving, same maker with WiFi7 on Windows. It's a new era.
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
Adison Vohn Caterson
2025-02-23 22:23:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joel
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Linux wins because it isn't the behemoth.
I knew it was just the company.
I don't like WalMart, but I will secretly shop there ;)
Linux supports my WiFi, made in China, edge technology as WiFi6 is
evolving, same maker with WiFi7 on Windows. It's a new era.
This openSUSE install went well, and other than screen orientation and
virtual keyboard, everything worked OOTB.
My first Linux use was SUSE 10.1, bought in a box from a store.
It was aggravating to get it running, I mostly remember having to get a
serial port modem, would not use my internal modem (I think US Robotics).

Tried Ubuntu, Fedora in between, been 5 years since I've tried again.

It's a computer.
--
End Transmission
Lawrence D'Oliveiro
2025-02-23 22:10:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
If Russia nuked New York, they'd only kill 5 Linux users.
The entire Internet runs on Linux. Like it or not, you’re one of those
“Linux users” right now.
Adison Vohn Caterson
2025-02-23 22:25:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
If Russia nuked New York, they'd only kill 5 Linux users.
The entire Internet runs on Linux. Like it or not, you’re one of those
“Linux users” right now.
No way!!
--
End Transmission
Paul
2025-02-22 21:22:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by chrisv
Post by Joel
(snip lies)
Way to miss Lawrence's point, goofball,
Any hyperbole or unfairness from Linux advocates pales in comparison
to the avalanche of idiocy and lies from the haters. Documented ad
nauseum, in here.
The only reason I promoted Win7 here, in the past, was because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Thinkpad Yoga 14 $1100 Reviewed February 11, 2015

1TB hard drive with an extra 16GB of solid-state cache... <=== boo and/or hiss (until the cache fails)

Core i5-4210U 2C 4T 15W 2.7GHz 4th gen Haswell
HD Graphics 4400 ~WDDM 2.0 or so
8GB of RAM
No mention of TPM, Secure Boot, UEFI

Win11 can be installed via Rufus-prepared USB stick. In
the same way my 4930K is currently running Windows 11.
Got there, using a Rufus.ie web site USB stick program.
Which can make a USB stick for a Linux ISO, or for a Windows ISO.
Uses SysLinux boot materials to make the stick boot.

If it really has a "hard drive" in it today, it would be
as slow as molasses at absolute zero, at boot time. Just deleting
the contents of the LCU folder (Last Cumulative Update), took
me ten minutes yesterday (my 1TB hard drive setup for commiserating
with HDD users). For one folder delete. You would want an SSD in
place of the hard drive, to improve the situation a bit.

You can get a 2.5" SSD, a Lexar, for around CDN $40 a piece.
That's what I use for scratch installs here. 256GB.

I noticed the slow NTFS HDD delete issue, on the Insider at first.
That the delete time of NTFS, it was taking a lot longer to delete.
Turning off Windows Defender didn't help. Even an SSD only helps a bit,
but every little bit counts at a time like that.

Paul
Adison Vohn Caterson
2025-02-22 21:48:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul
Post by Adison Vohn Caterson
Post by Joel
Post by chrisv
Post by Joel
(snip lies)
Way to miss Lawrence's point, goofball,
Any hyperbole or unfairness from Linux advocates pales in comparison
to the avalanche of idiocy and lies from the haters. Documented ad
nauseum, in here.
The only reason I promoted Win7 here, in the past, was because at the
time it really did represent something new and improved in computing.
Today, Linux is hands-down the winner.
Linux is the winner?
At what?
I run Linux on this Thinkpad Yoga 14 because Windows 11 won't run on it,
and Windows 10 is dead soon. So in that case Linux is better.
This laptop can be folded into a tablet, and I can tell you that under
Win 10, worked a charm. Under Linux, screen orientation doesn't work,
virtual keyboard doesn't work. I only get a virtual keyboard at the
logon screen.
On a 15" Alienware laptop, it's had Windows 11 on it for 3+ years.
Runs great, has never blue screened, locked up, refused to do my
bidding. Some Windows updates have broken the Dell Support App and the
Alienware Command Center, but a fix usually comes from MS or Dell, or a
Revo uninstall/reinstall fixes it. I wouldn't even bother putting Linux
on the Alienware, as I doubt selecting which video card I want is an
option under Linux, and I doubt fan control would be as easy under Linux
as it is with Windows 11.
Windows 11 is a computing tool.
Linux is a computing tool.
The choices being available is the winner.
Thinkpad Yoga 14 $1100 Reviewed February 11, 2015
1TB hard drive with an extra 16GB of solid-state cache... <=== boo and/or hiss (until the cache fails)
Core i5-4210U 2C 4T 15W 2.7GHz 4th gen Haswell
HD Graphics 4400 ~WDDM 2.0 or so
8GB of RAM
No mention of TPM, Secure Boot, UEFI
This Yoga is

CPU:
Info: dual core model: Intel Core i5-6200U bits: 64 type: MT MCP cache:
L2: 512 KiB
Speed (MHz): avg: 425 min/max: 400/2800 cores: 1: 500 2: 400 3: 400 4: 400
Graphics:
Device-1: Intel Skylake GT2 [HD Graphics 520] driver: i915 v: kernel
Device-2: NVIDIA GM108M [GeForce 940M] driver: nvidia v: 570.86.16
Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 1.21.1.11 with: Xwayland v: 24.1.1 driver:
X: loaded: modesetting,nvidia unloaded: fbdev,vesa dri: iris gpu: i915
resolution: 1920x1080~60Hz
Drives:
Local Storage: total: 238.47 GiB used: 9.9 GiB (4.2%)
ID-1: /dev/sda vendor: LITE-ON model: LCH-256V2S size: 238.47 GiB
Info:
Processes: 186 Uptime: 0h 37m Memory: available: 7.65 GiB
used: 1.52 GiB (19.9%) Shell: Bash inxi: 3.3.27
UEFI: LENOVO v: R05ET36W (1.14) date: 10/12/2015
Post by Paul
Win11 can be installed via Rufus-prepared USB stick. In
the same way my 4930K is currently running Windows 11.
Got there, using a Rufus.ie web site USB stick program.
Which can make a USB stick for a Linux ISO, or for a Windows ISO.
Uses SysLinux boot materials to make the stick boot.
If it really has a "hard drive" in it today, it would be
as slow as molasses at absolute zero, at boot time. Just deleting
the contents of the LCU folder (Last Cumulative Update), took
me ten minutes yesterday (my 1TB hard drive setup for commiserating
with HDD users). For one folder delete. You would want an SSD in
place of the hard drive, to improve the situation a bit.
You can get a 2.5" SSD, a Lexar, for around CDN $40 a piece.
That's what I use for scratch installs here. 256GB.
I noticed the slow NTFS HDD delete issue, on the Insider at first.
That the delete time of NTFS, it was taking a lot longer to delete.
Turning off Windows Defender didn't help. Even an SSD only helps a bit,
but every little bit counts at a time like that.
Paul
I'm going to use the laptop to learn Linux inside out ;)
Or just learn to use it.
--
End Transmission
rbowman
2025-02-23 05:08:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul
Core i5-4210U 2C 4T 15W 2.7GHz 4th gen Haswell
The Fedora box is a Core i5-4590 and does well. It's not a high end
processor but it is 4 cores and faster than the U (mobile) series,.
Joel
2025-02-22 02:21:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
“Dozens of things you can do to clean up a fresh install of Windows 11
24H2 and Edge”
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/02/what-i-do-to-clean-up-a-clean-install-of-windows-11-23h2-and-edge/>.
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
I'm grateful for Linux.
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
CrudeSausage
2025-02-22 02:29:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joel
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
“Dozens of things you can do to clean up a fresh install of Windows 11
24H2 and Edge”
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/02/what-i-do-to-clean-up-a-clean-install-of-windows-11-23h2-and-edge/>.
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
I'm grateful for Linux.
Without Linux, all computers would become useless like my
father-in-law's Surface RT is now. It turns on, but you can't update it
or use the Store. You are essentially locked out of everything because
the company decided it won't be supported anymore. It won't even let you
update to the latest version it supports. Even Apple isn't that horrible.
--
God be with you,

CrudeSausage
John 14:6
Joel
2025-02-22 03:00:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by CrudeSausage
Post by Joel
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
“Dozens of things you can do to clean up a fresh install of Windows 11
24H2 and Edge”
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/02/what-i-do-to-clean-up-a-clean-install-of-windows-11-23h2-and-edge/>.
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
I'm grateful for Linux.
Without Linux, all computers would become useless like my
father-in-law's Surface RT is now. It turns on, but you can't update it
or use the Store. You are essentially locked out of everything because
the company decided it won't be supported anymore. It won't even let you
update to the latest version it supports. Even Apple isn't that horrible.
And yet trusted sources poll Windows at greater than 80% of the
market ...
--
Joel W. Crump

Amendment XIV
Section 1.

[...] No state shall make or enforce any law which shall
abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the
United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of
life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;
nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal
protection of the laws.

Dobbs rewrites this, it is invalid precedent. States are
liable for denying needed abortions, e.g. TX.
Lawrence D'Oliveiro
2025-02-22 03:03:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by CrudeSausage
Without Linux, all computers would become useless like my
father-in-law's Surface RT is now.
Windows “RT” = “Reduced Technology”.
CrudeSausage
2025-02-22 03:09:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Post by CrudeSausage
Without Linux, all computers would become useless like my
father-in-law's Surface RT is now.
Windows “RT” = “Reduced Technology”.
If they could only have made it a little less complicated to install
Linux on it. It's underpowered, so I'm not sure if there is even a
point, but Linux would have prevented it from being recycled. At this
point, it doesn't look like I have much of a choice but to drop it off
at the nearest electronics store.
--
God be with you,

CrudeSausage
John 14:6
rbowman
2025-02-22 03:59:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by CrudeSausage
If they could only have made it a little less complicated to install
Linux on it. It's underpowered, so I'm not sure if there is even a
point, but Linux would have prevented it from being recycled. At this
point, it doesn't look like I have much of a choice but to drop it off
at the nearest electronics store.
The tools are there to root it as long as it's the unpatched 8.1.
rbowman
2025-02-22 03:50:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by CrudeSausage
Without Linux, all computers would become useless like my
father-in-law's Surface RT is now. It turns on, but you can't update it
or use the Store. You are essentially locked out of everything because
the company decided it won't be supported anymore. It won't even let you
update to the latest version it supports. Even Apple isn't that horrible.
https://hackaday.com/2024/02/02/your-surface-rt-can-become-useful-again-
with-raspberry-pi-os/

I'm running Raspberry Pi OS on a RPi 5 and it isn't going to set any
benchmark records but it is perfectly usable. The 32bit OS will have some
limitations. For example VS Code is 64bit only. I have the same
limitations with my 32bit Debian box. however the RT will be useful for
something other than a doorstop.

I haven't heard much about Microsoft's latest ARM attempt. I wouldn't jump
on that one either. It's unfortunate that MS screwed up the first time
around. I don't know if it was them or the press and vendors that didn't
clearly convey that it was not the Windows people expected.
CrudeSausage
2025-02-22 14:07:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by rbowman
Post by CrudeSausage
Without Linux, all computers would become useless like my
father-in-law's Surface RT is now. It turns on, but you can't update it
or use the Store. You are essentially locked out of everything because
the company decided it won't be supported anymore. It won't even let you
update to the latest version it supports. Even Apple isn't that horrible.
https://hackaday.com/2024/02/02/your-surface-rt-can-become-useful-again-
with-raspberry-pi-os/
I'm running Raspberry Pi OS on a RPi 5 and it isn't going to set any
benchmark records but it is perfectly usable. The 32bit OS will have some
limitations. For example VS Code is 64bit only. I have the same
limitations with my 32bit Debian box. however the RT will be useful for
something other than a doorstop.
I haven't heard much about Microsoft's latest ARM attempt. I wouldn't jump
on that one either. It's unfortunate that MS screwed up the first time
around. I don't know if it was them or the press and vendors that didn't
clearly convey that it was not the Windows people expected.
While I think it would renew the device to put Linux on it, I think that
there is no point. The keyboard on this thing is absolute garbage, and I
don't see myself using it at work for any purpose either. Recycling it
is putting it out of its misery.
--
God be with you,

CrudeSausage
John 14:6
Mark Lloyd
2025-02-22 20:00:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Joel
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
“Dozens of things you can do to clean up a fresh install of Windows 11
24H2 and Edge”
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/02/what-i-do-to-clean-up-a-clean-
install-of-windows-11-23h2-and-edge/>.
Post by Joel
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
I'm grateful for Linux.
Yes, I find Linux faster and easier to install than Windows (and it's not
just the assume-you're-a-thief codes).
--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"Two great European narcotics, alcohol and Christianity." [Nietzsche,
Twilight of the Idols, "What the Germans Lack," aph. 2 (1889)]
Paul
2025-02-22 20:58:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Post by Joel
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
“Dozens of things you can do to clean up a fresh install of Windows 11
24H2 and Edge”
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/02/what-i-do-to-clean-up-a-clean-
install-of-windows-11-23h2-and-edge/>.
Post by Joel
Post by Lawrence D'Oliveiro
Got nothing better to do over the next week? Why not spend the next
chunk of your life on a fresh Dimdows install!
I'm grateful for Linux.
Yes, I find Linux faster and easier to install than Windows (and it's not
just the assume-you're-a-thief codes).
But your background determines whether you will have an easy time of
it or not. I had fifteen years of Unix, so at least the concepts
weren't strange when I saw them. There is still a /etc/fstab
and a /etc/mtab and even the df (diskfree) and the ls (Listdir)
we had in Unix.

People who have used Windows, and never adjusted a thing on their
computer while doing so, those are not going to be good candidates
for a transition. Just getting the USB stick prepared, that's
going to be an ordeal.

A few people don't know what a USB stick is :-) There is no bottom
to this barrel. It's going to be a bottomless barrel of fun, to
move the Windows refugees onto something else. Hours of labor to save
one drowning soul. Times 400,000,000 or so.

I've run into people, despite my instructing them on entering
the BIOS or using the popup boot, they can't get their OEM computer
to boot from a USB stick.

Like, if someone names an arbitrary video card (let us pick the
FX5200 as an example), how would that affect my Linux experience ?
Can I install ? What distro is that ? What distro is friendly to
arbitrary video cards (my 7900GT which should have worked but the
graphics crashed on boot stick) ? How much RAM will I need ?
Already, we're wading in the deep end, without a swim lesson.
Sometimes, I find I really do need 3GB to get a distro to boot,
other times a sample distro uses a lot less memory. If someone
asks me to explain that, I'll be waving my arms around like
a windmill.

Paul
Lawrence D'Oliveiro
2025-02-22 21:32:34 UTC
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There is still a /etc/fstab and a /etc/mtab ...
***@theon:~> ls -l /etc/mtab
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 19 May 5 2023 /etc/mtab -> ../proc/self/mounts
chrisv
2025-02-22 21:55:11 UTC
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Post by Paul
But your background determines whether you will have an easy time of
it or not. I had fifteen years of Unix, so at least the concepts
weren't strange when I saw them. There is still a /etc/fstab
and a /etc/mtab and even the df (diskfree) and the ls (Listdir)
we had in Unix.
Linux can be used without that knowledge.
Post by Paul
People who have used Windows, and never adjusted a thing on their
computer while doing so, those are not going to be good candidates
for a transition. Just getting the USB stick prepared, that's
going to be an ordeal.
Anyone that incompetent probably should get a Mac.
Post by Paul
A few people don't know what a USB stick is :-) There is no bottom
to this barrel. It's going to be a bottomless barrel of fun, to
move the Windows refugees onto something else. Hours of labor to save
one drowning soul. Times 400,000,000 or so.
I've run into people, despite my instructing them on entering
the BIOS or using the popup boot, they can't get their OEM computer
to boot from a USB stick.
Anyone that incompetent probably should get a Mac.
Post by Paul
Like, if someone names an arbitrary video card (let us pick the
FX5200 as an example), how would that affect my Linux experience ?
They only times I've had the (super easy) Linux installation fail is
over some oddball video adaptor. The vast majority of PC's use Intel
graphics, which is never a problem.
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